SPEAKER_0 [00:00:00]
Dramas, please.
SPEAKER_0 [00:00:13]
Yeah.
SPEAKER_0 [00:00:20]
This is life
SPEAKER_0 [00:00:22]
with a twist of lemon.
SPEAKER_0 [00:00:24]
Alright. Listen, fellas.
SPEAKER_0 [00:00:26]
Whenever we do this, the episode tends to run long. I put a meatloaf on my brand new smoker, which I'm sure we'll talk about in a future episode. But the internal temp is at 89. I gotta start basing at one forty, so
SPEAKER_0 [00:00:39]
we can't we can't do that. What do we do? Three hours for end game? Is that what we did?
SPEAKER_1 [00:00:43]
Yeah. I think I think our record was three hours. Okay. What
SPEAKER_0 [00:00:47]
let's see. Did we do we did like two hours. Was two. Yeah. That was on one division. Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:00:53]
Yes. Yep. And everything else coming to I mean, the one we had about everything coming down the pipeline was crazy. Yeah. That one we just kept going and go John fell asleep. He actually then woke up. Woke up and you guys were still talking. We were still talking. Yeah. So
SPEAKER_0 [00:01:07]
sometimes I think that's the episodes that you really like, John. Like you you you like to be able to just, you know,
SPEAKER_0 [00:01:12]
sit back in your chair, smoke your pipe, fall asleep and wake up and the episodes recorded. Right. So Exactly. Alright. This is life with a twist of lemon and this is a special episode
SPEAKER_0 [00:01:23]
on the new Marvel movie, Black Widow. So spoiler alert, if you have not seen this movie,
SPEAKER_0 [00:01:30]
you should press pause. You should go fork out $30
SPEAKER_0 [00:01:33]
with Disney plus and rent it,
SPEAKER_0 [00:01:36]
and you can watch it multiple times like like John did,
SPEAKER_0 [00:01:39]
and enjoy
SPEAKER_0 [00:01:41]
this movie, and then come back and and listen to us talk about it. Because unfortunately,
SPEAKER_0 [00:01:47]
if you if you don't do that, you're we're gonna spoil it for you. But, you know, it is what it is. So
SPEAKER_0 [00:01:52]
our our friend of the podcast,
SPEAKER_0 [00:01:54]
Patrick Stervant, affectionately called Patty,
SPEAKER_0 [00:01:57]
is joining us today as he does with any important
SPEAKER_0 [00:02:00]
Marvel
SPEAKER_0 [00:02:01]
moment in time
SPEAKER_0 [00:02:03]
to discuss this movie. Patty, don't you say hi?
SPEAKER_1 [00:02:06]
Hi, everyone. I feel like we talk about Marvel a lot. Like, it's almost
SPEAKER_2 [00:02:10]
a thing for us now. I I mean, you are the Marvel guest. Yeah. Do you wanna talk about something else sometime, Patrick? You just let us Anytime.
SPEAKER_1 [00:02:18]
You guys have you guys send me the invite and I'll be on. Okay. Well, we alright. Alright. Challenge accepted. We could do that. We could definitely do that. But today You guys don't like Arby's? We can talk about Arby's. I'm fine with that, you know. Tell Whatever you wanna do. Tell me what you think about Raising Cane's.
SPEAKER_1 [00:02:31]
Oh, I think Raising Cane's is trash. Really? Okay. Yep. Chicken Express all the way, man. Chicken Express. Okay. Isn't all Chicken Express though?
SPEAKER_1 [00:02:41]
No. But Chicken Express is a place. You won't understand. Alright. Is that The next time in Texas,
SPEAKER_0 [00:02:46]
we'll go to Chickanees, we'll have a great time. Okay. So that's that's another restaurant is what you're telling me. Does it Yes. Does it exist exist outside of the country of Texas?
SPEAKER_1 [00:02:57]
All good things exist inside the country of Texas except Portillo's. Oh. So Alright. Yeah. By the way, were you Sunday. Were you surprised at all that that was number one on both John and May's lists? No. I'm actually very upset with myself that I did not include it
SPEAKER_1 [00:03:11]
in my list. I eat it so infrequently.
SPEAKER_0 [00:03:14]
The last time I had it was actually for endgame. Yeah. On the way home from the year. So Yeah. You you were like, you were so channeled. You like, we talked about getting
SPEAKER_0 [00:03:24]
because you were hungry. It's like, you wanna go to Purtillas or whatever. You're like, yeah.
SPEAKER_0 [00:03:28]
And then, I mean, you were in the zone. It was like a zen like moment for you to just indulge I love that place. Yeah. It's so this is what what what you experienced there is what I experienced
SPEAKER_0 [00:03:39]
the first time I came back from Pittsburgh after we lived out there to the Chicago land area and I sink my teeth into an Italian beef. I was like, oh, this
SPEAKER_0 [00:03:48]
this is all that is good and right with the world. Pure happiness. Yeah. It's like it's like if if the infinity stones aligned and were used for good rather than to wipe out half of all living things. Right? That's that's Portillo's. Or paperweights.
SPEAKER_0 [00:04:02]
There you go. Or paperweights.
SPEAKER_0 [00:04:05]
Alright.
SPEAKER_0 [00:04:06]
So when when John and I last met by the way, you noticed that we've been but we're not a Marvel podcast, but we've been doing post credit scenes.
SPEAKER_1 [00:04:14]
I have. Yeah. No. You guys have been doing really well. I'm sure all of your normal listeners
SPEAKER_1 [00:04:19]
actually appreciate
SPEAKER_0 [00:04:21]
Yeah. Right? They just stop. Normal content.
SPEAKER_0 [00:04:23]
Yeah. The next twenty minutes is John and Stan rambling about something I don't care about. No. So on the last episode, we speculated
SPEAKER_0 [00:04:30]
well, we were concerned, I should say, that you might not have seen
SPEAKER_0 [00:04:34]
the movie because we hadn't heard from you. You were you were radio silent. I know you've been you've been busy, like, working or doing a job or something, traveling the country.
SPEAKER_0 [00:04:42]
But I I've gotta ask, this this movie came out on Friday.
SPEAKER_0 [00:04:46]
When did when did you watch this movie, Patty? Sunday.
SPEAKER_1 [00:04:50]
This is the first Marvel movie I did not see
SPEAKER_1 [00:04:54]
in theaters in opening day since
SPEAKER_0 [00:05:00]
the Incredible Hulk. Wow. That doesn't even count. That doesn't even count.
SPEAKER_1 [00:05:05]
I think I've seen every other single one in theaters on opening day.
SPEAKER_1 [00:05:10]
So I
SPEAKER_1 [00:05:11]
Maybe Dark World.
SPEAKER_0 [00:05:12]
I That's a long time ago. I think yeah. Dark Dark World was not worth seeing in theaters, but we digress. John, do you remember what you said in the last episode
SPEAKER_0 [00:05:20]
about Patty and watching the movie? I said,
SPEAKER_2 [00:05:24]
if he didn't watch Saturday at the latest, I didn't even know who he was anymore.
SPEAKER_0 [00:05:28]
Alright. So
SPEAKER_0 [00:05:30]
so Patty I was sitting
SPEAKER_1 [00:05:32]
on in the airport in Denver for nine hours
SPEAKER_1 [00:05:37]
on Saturday.
SPEAKER_1 [00:05:38]
And I I mean the the Denver Airport has internet Patty. Like who are you? It does but I did not wanna watch it without my beautiful wife. I mean who would do that? I but
SPEAKER_0 [00:05:49]
but
SPEAKER_0 [00:05:50]
I would watch it and then I would get home and rewatch it with my beautiful wife. I just But I What did you do tell her that I What did you do with our patty? That's all we wanna know. I'm sorry. He was stuck he was stuck in a hard place, man.
SPEAKER_0 [00:06:03]
Denver.
SPEAKER_0 [00:06:03]
Alright.
SPEAKER_0 [00:06:05]
So
SPEAKER_0 [00:06:06]
you've watched it now. Right? I have.
SPEAKER_0 [00:06:09]
John, you have you finished it twice now?
SPEAKER_0 [00:06:12]
So the second time, there were certain parts where I skipped ahead, but I wanted to actually be able to talk intelligently about something on this podcast. Alright. Well, you you're in a better situation than I am because I intended to watch it a second time last night, and instead I was assembling a new smoker. Again, future episode, we'll we'll talk about another time. So I never got around to it. I got I got through the opening credits, that was it.
SPEAKER_0 [00:06:36]
This this movie, we've been waiting for for a while now.
SPEAKER_0 [00:06:39]
I'm trying to think, this is supposed to come out last fall. Right?
SPEAKER_1 [00:06:44]
Yeah. Either last fall or last June, July. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe maybe it's say it's almost been delayed for a full year. Yeah.
SPEAKER_0 [00:06:52]
So I obviously, like Disney, I think first and foremost didn't know like how do you release a movie when movie theaters are not open. Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:07:00]
And and I think a lot of places have wised up to we're just gonna release some of our streaming service. I think it remains to be seen whether or not this, you know, happens in perpetuity or not. I really hope it does, but, you know, it's another discussion for another time.
SPEAKER_0 [00:07:13]
So the principal shooting on this film ended in October 2019.
SPEAKER_0 [00:07:18]
I think it's important context because the like the principal filming of this has been done for almost two years now.
SPEAKER_0 [00:07:26]
Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:07:27]
And I think this is this movie in and of itself is interesting because
SPEAKER_0 [00:07:32]
chronologically,
SPEAKER_0 [00:07:33]
it's all out of whack. Right? And I was trying to think,
SPEAKER_0 [00:07:36]
all the movies that we have, right, there there are they're flat, like, flashback movies, and I would I would say the original Captain America is one, and Captain Marvel is another. We're, It is very clear
SPEAKER_0 [00:07:47]
that we are going to go back in time a significant amount.
SPEAKER_0 [00:07:50]
Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:07:51]
This one, we're not going back in time a significant amount, but it is chronologically out of place with the, really the the milestone,
SPEAKER_0 [00:07:59]
the the epic bookend
SPEAKER_0 [00:08:01]
to phase three, which is Endgame.
SPEAKER_0 [00:08:04]
So we're rewinding because, you know, surprise,
SPEAKER_0 [00:08:07]
Black Widow's dead. So she's she's alive in order to have this movie. This takes place after Civil War, my my favorite non Infinity Wars movie.
SPEAKER_0 [00:08:17]
Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:08:18]
But
SPEAKER_0 [00:08:19]
before Infinity Wars,
SPEAKER_0 [00:08:21]
and we've got a lull there. We had a lull as movies were releasing too.
SPEAKER_0 [00:08:25]
Right? There was there was like a there was a weird gap where we didn't actually know what was going on in Earth really as as far as the Avengers go.
SPEAKER_0 [00:08:34]
And this fills that time period. So like, did did that strike either of you
SPEAKER_0 [00:08:39]
as odd? Like, were you uncomfortable kinda getting into this? Or or wondering like, how how are most people receiving
SPEAKER_0 [00:08:45]
this, like, rewind in time?
SPEAKER_1 [00:08:50]
Yeah. I think to the general audience that doesn't follow it religiously,
SPEAKER_1 [00:08:54]
there it's probably a little bit confusing
SPEAKER_1 [00:08:57]
because you watch her die and then all of a sudden she's back. And then the
SPEAKER_1 [00:09:02]
callbacks to where it actually takes place on the timeline
SPEAKER_1 [00:09:05]
are probably a little difficult to follow. They're they're not clear at all, are they? Yeah. They're very subtle. The biggest thing is like you see Thunderbolt Ross coming after her in the first five minutes after the initial the prologue kind of scene.
SPEAKER_1 [00:09:19]
And that makes sense to us,
SPEAKER_1 [00:09:23]
but anyone else might be a little confused how she's not at the bottom of a gigantic
SPEAKER_0 [00:09:28]
cliff. Yeah. Right. Like what what are the Sokovia Accords? Right? I think that was the first thing. Even my kids who are like Marvel aware
SPEAKER_0 [00:09:36]
were trying to, like, recall because they were expecting like, and again, this is what I think what our brains do.
SPEAKER_0 [00:09:42]
Endgame has happened. Everybody's back from the blip.
SPEAKER_0 [00:09:45]
Right? In fact, the last Spider Man movie we saw is post blip. Yep. So so why why isn't why isn't this? And I mean realistically, it's been five years since we talked about the Sokovia Accords. Like that was 02/2016.
SPEAKER_1 [00:10:01]
That's a long time. It is. And even in the Marvel time line like post endgame is 2025.
SPEAKER_1 [00:10:08]
So I mean, that's a long period of time where you have to kind of sit back and remember everything that's happened.
SPEAKER_1 [00:10:15]
I understand why the movie falls the way it does.
SPEAKER_1 [00:10:19]
They wanted to give her her own shining moment.
SPEAKER_1 [00:10:23]
I get it.
SPEAKER_1 [00:10:24]
I wish it would have come out in sequence though. It would have made a lot more sense to come out in sequence. Yeah. I definitely agree. So tell me if I'm mistaken in this. I I get the impression that this was a
SPEAKER_0 [00:10:35]
fan driven production. Meaning that, like, I don't I don't believe that Marvel set out
SPEAKER_0 [00:10:40]
to do a Black Widow movie originally.
SPEAKER_0 [00:10:44]
I I think that there was enough interest in the character as she developed over time because
SPEAKER_0 [00:10:49]
I don't Do people even remember? She came up in in Iron Man two. Right. You know? Like, it's a long it's a long time ago. She's been around for a while in the MCU.
SPEAKER_0 [00:10:59]
But my impression and and you can tell me if I'm wrong, Patty, but it's
SPEAKER_0 [00:11:03]
like fans wanted this and
SPEAKER_0 [00:11:06]
I don't know Disney Cave, the Marvel Cave, whatever, how you wanna say it like, they gave fans
SPEAKER_0 [00:11:13]
the thing that they've been asking for.
SPEAKER_1 [00:11:15]
Yeah. And I I think they saw the reaction that people wanted a Black Widow movie.
SPEAKER_1 [00:11:21]
She was such a driving force in the other movies like she
SPEAKER_1 [00:11:25]
I mean, is Black Widow just like Downey Junior is
SPEAKER_1 [00:11:29]
is Stark.
SPEAKER_1 [00:11:31]
And that makes sense. And it makes sense to want to give her kind of that bowing out last moment.
SPEAKER_1 [00:11:38]
Yeah. I I it, and I I see I think it does serve a purpose. All the things that it sets up for the future that I know we'll talk about here in the next
SPEAKER_1 [00:11:48]
Four hours. I probably have thirty
SPEAKER_1 [00:11:50]
thirty seven minutes left. No.
SPEAKER_0 [00:11:53]
There's warm setting on this this thing that I could try when we get that stage.
SPEAKER_1 [00:11:58]
We'll see. Hey, you have to test out the new smoker Oh, yeah. To see what it can do. Definitely.
SPEAKER_0 [00:12:03]
Alright. So Iron Man two came out in 2010.
SPEAKER_0 [00:12:06]
Right? Do you remember
SPEAKER_0 [00:12:08]
Scarlett Johansson's kind of reputation
SPEAKER_0 [00:12:11]
in in the industry in 2010? Do you recall that at all?
SPEAKER_0 [00:12:16]
That was a long time ago. It was. It was. Let let me let me give a parallel. Do you remember Robert Downey Junior's
SPEAKER_0 [00:12:22]
reputation when Iron Man one came out? Quite. Yes. Oh, he it was it was straight up trash. Right? And I think I think at the time that Scarlett Johansson came on to the scene with Iron Man two, she was not considered a serious actress.
SPEAKER_0 [00:12:33]
Right? I I think that's just kind of the reputation that she had for better or for worse. I'm not saying that was right or wrong. I just think that that she had created a a certain
SPEAKER_0 [00:12:42]
persona for herself
SPEAKER_0 [00:12:44]
that that did not like warrant the kind of acting that I think we saw in this movie.
SPEAKER_0 [00:12:50]
Alright? Or for that matter in Endgame. Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:12:53]
Because she's got some seriously emotionally
SPEAKER_0 [00:12:56]
deep moments in Endgame.
SPEAKER_0 [00:12:59]
And and I I think the same way that kind of Robert Downey, you know, stepped up and became Iron Man, and now Iron Man is Robert Downey. Kinda know what you were saying. That's that's what Scarlett Johansson did with with Black Widow.
SPEAKER_0 [00:13:11]
Alright.
SPEAKER_0 [00:13:13]
The opening credits scene
SPEAKER_0 [00:13:15]
or I don't know what what's even called it? Prologue?
SPEAKER_0 [00:13:19]
I think it's a prologue. Yeah. Think that fits as a prologue. This is I've we haven't seen this in Marvel, have we? Like when when we had a prologue like this?
SPEAKER_1 [00:13:25]
This didn't feel like a Marvel movie until the last thirty five,
SPEAKER_1 [00:13:29]
forty minutes. It really didn't. Which was both impressive
SPEAKER_1 [00:13:33]
and I did not know how I felt about it.
SPEAKER_1 [00:13:36]
Well, I was very torn the entire time until it actually became a superhero movie again because it's a pretty decent spy movie Yep.
SPEAKER_1 [00:13:47]
Outside of like the the superhero character development for like Red Guardian stuff. Like, I was actually impressed that
SPEAKER_1 [00:13:54]
it's true to form for what it's supposed to Car
SPEAKER_0 [00:13:58]
chases and all. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Well, and I kept thinking about you, John, because I was like, oh, man, please don't go playing with cinema. Please cinematography.
SPEAKER_0 [00:14:06]
Please don't go playing with cinematography. John's gonna hate it. John's gonna hate it. Give me some long boring conversations in a in a single room, please. Please, for John's sake.
SPEAKER_0 [00:14:15]
The long conversations have not been boring in Loki's. Oh, okay. Alright. Fair point. Fair point. Fair point.
SPEAKER_0 [00:14:21]
So this prologue, right, it it's it's different
SPEAKER_0 [00:14:24]
and there is a huge amount of context that is set up, like, I I felt honestly overwhelmed
SPEAKER_0 [00:14:30]
watching the prologue because the amount of detail is being thrown at you. Right? Mhmm.
SPEAKER_0 [00:14:36]
We've got this whole set up in Ohio.
SPEAKER_0 [00:14:38]
I the whole '5.
SPEAKER_0 [00:14:40]
Yeah. What a good year. What year were you born, Patty?
SPEAKER_0 [00:14:43]
'90. I was five. Oh, look at you. Just barely out of diapers.
SPEAKER_0 [00:14:48]
Yep.
SPEAKER_0 [00:14:49]
So
SPEAKER_0 [00:14:51]
so we're in the Midwest which I, first of all, I love. Right? Because,
SPEAKER_0 [00:14:56]
you know, we gotta have glamorous locations
SPEAKER_0 [00:14:59]
for everybody from from Robert Downey Junior to, you know, the the King of Asgard.
SPEAKER_0 [00:15:04]
But Black Widow Ohio.
SPEAKER_0 [00:15:07]
Is essentially Ohio. Yeah. Which is, by the way, if you're keeping score at home, there's the Midwest and then there's Ohio. Like the rest of the Midwest acknowledges that Ohio was probably part of the Midwest, but we don't like it. Okay? You got nothing to be proud of over there in Ohio and you know it. Right? Like like what do you got? You got college basketball, college football? Maybe? Maybe.
SPEAKER_0 [00:15:26]
I
SPEAKER_0 [00:15:27]
digress.
SPEAKER_0 [00:15:28]
So
SPEAKER_0 [00:15:30]
she's she's essentially a Russian spy. We we see this family that's been fabricated. I kept thinking of the TV show, The Americans, when I saw this.
SPEAKER_1 [00:15:39]
Did you guys ever watch The Americans? I did not. Oh, it's the first season. Awesome. But yeah, no, very very
SPEAKER_0 [00:15:45]
yeah. I see where you're going. It's a it's a first of it's a great show. It was on AMC.
SPEAKER_0 [00:15:49]
But the the premise is that you have a family of Russian spies, really a mom and a dad who live in The States,
SPEAKER_0 [00:15:56]
and they are trying to create or they're they're they're they have kids that they hope to indoctrinate into the system, and then, you know, if you're born in The States and you can prove that, you could like join the CIA or whatever. Like, there's a there's a whole, you know, whole deep spy thing going on there. But
SPEAKER_0 [00:16:14]
we we've got kind of that element. We've got the Cuba thing. We've got a pretty
SPEAKER_0 [00:16:20]
heroic
SPEAKER_0 [00:16:20]
escape.
SPEAKER_0 [00:16:22]
And
SPEAKER_0 [00:16:23]
I'd it took me a second to realize that we were dealing with Red Guardian, right, in the escape because it's not
SPEAKER_0 [00:16:29]
it's not the the image of Red Guardian that I was expecting us to open with.
SPEAKER_1 [00:16:33]
Mhmm.
SPEAKER_0 [00:16:34]
I kept thinking about
SPEAKER_0 [00:16:36]
the soul stone
SPEAKER_0 [00:16:38]
moment in Endgame,
SPEAKER_0 [00:16:40]
where
SPEAKER_0 [00:16:41]
Red Skull refers to her father.
SPEAKER_0 [00:16:45]
Right? And her father's name. And I was I kept trying to like tie that back. And and I'm gonna jump all the way to the end of the movie now, but we we eventually will learn
SPEAKER_0 [00:16:53]
that Black Widow will find out who her mother is, but we still like
SPEAKER_0 [00:16:57]
the only time she learns about her father will be
SPEAKER_0 [00:17:01]
when she is
SPEAKER_0 [00:17:02]
getting the soul stone. Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:17:07]
Yep. Alright. So
SPEAKER_0 [00:17:09]
chugging along. We get past Ohio. Where are we at Patty?
SPEAKER_1 [00:17:13]
I I think it's it's
SPEAKER_1 [00:17:15]
a good thing to point out that she is completely aware
SPEAKER_1 [00:17:20]
what is going on. She knows that she's Russian and that their her family is are spies. She knows.
SPEAKER_1 [00:17:27]
I do not think at that point her sister knows at all. Yelena has no idea.
SPEAKER_0 [00:17:33]
Definitely seems clues. Interesting kids Yeah. That they cast for these.
SPEAKER_0 [00:17:38]
I I didn't exactly feel like the little girl who represented Scarlett Johansson looked like Scarlett Johansson,
SPEAKER_0 [00:17:45]
but seemed to be a pretty decent actress nonetheless. Right? Like Mhmm. Yep. That's some heavy stuff for a little kid too, especially the scene where
SPEAKER_0 [00:17:54]
she kicks the crap out of some soldiers and takes the takes the gun from them. Right? Like Yeah. And then,
SPEAKER_1 [00:18:00]
being able to switch between Russian dialogue
SPEAKER_1 [00:18:03]
and English dialogue
SPEAKER_1 [00:18:04]
with the emotion is that was pretty impressive. Yeah. Yeah. So, know, already like we're
SPEAKER_0 [00:18:10]
we're off to a good start I think and I'm again I'm watching the whole time thinking, John, please please like it because it's already better than Talk to the Winter Soldier.
SPEAKER_0 [00:18:21]
Alright. So where do we go from Ohio?
SPEAKER_1 [00:18:25]
From Ohio,
SPEAKER_1 [00:18:26]
we go to Cuba. Does that count? Well, I mean, after Cuba. Basically,
SPEAKER_0 [00:18:31]
we've got this whole setup. Right? And then we're gonna we're gonna traverse to
SPEAKER_0 [00:18:35]
Yelena
SPEAKER_0 [00:18:37]
with I mean, like, again, I think if you don't know the MCU, right? Like, don't know that one, Yelena is probably from the Red Room.
SPEAKER_0 [00:18:44]
And two, that she's with a whole
SPEAKER_0 [00:18:47]
cabal of Red Room.
SPEAKER_0 [00:18:50]
I I don't know. What do you call them? Ladies or or black widows. They're widows. Widows. Right? And
SPEAKER_0 [00:18:55]
they're they're chasing down somebody. And what was interesting to me is you don't think initially
SPEAKER_0 [00:19:02]
that that is
SPEAKER_0 [00:19:04]
someone on the same team. Right? But that's actually what it is. They're they're hunting down one of their own.
SPEAKER_1 [00:19:09]
Well, yeah. And I don't think you even realize that
SPEAKER_1 [00:19:12]
she is a, quote, bad guy at that point either.
SPEAKER_1 [00:19:16]
Like, you see someone who you just saw as a child
SPEAKER_1 [00:19:21]
in this role,
SPEAKER_1 [00:19:23]
I think your initial
SPEAKER_1 [00:19:25]
the reaction they wanted to gauge from you is that she might be good,
SPEAKER_1 [00:19:29]
but you also know that widows are bad.
SPEAKER_1 [00:19:32]
Right. Right. So I think they're kind of playing with that a little bit too.
SPEAKER_1 [00:19:36]
And then they make the
SPEAKER_1 [00:19:39]
they make the capture and the kill
SPEAKER_1 [00:19:42]
and it's revealed when she's sprayed
SPEAKER_1 [00:19:45]
with the
SPEAKER_1 [00:19:47]
the chemical that becomes the the plot device for the movie
SPEAKER_1 [00:19:52]
that she was under control of something.
SPEAKER_0 [00:19:55]
Yeah. And I this is the first hint that we have
SPEAKER_0 [00:19:58]
about I think really the underlying problem that they're gonna try to solve which is mind control.
SPEAKER_0 [00:20:03]
Right? And we we've interestingly,
SPEAKER_0 [00:20:06]
on the mind control front, we have actually dealt with mind control
SPEAKER_0 [00:20:10]
in the MCU, but it has been scoped really to just Loki
SPEAKER_0 [00:20:15]
at this point. Right? Right.
SPEAKER_0 [00:20:17]
And I don't know I don't know if this was intentional, but I thought it was kind of convenient timing.
SPEAKER_0 [00:20:21]
It's
SPEAKER_0 [00:20:23]
I I I don't maybe I'm maybe I'm putting too much into it, but should we be drawing a conclusion
SPEAKER_1 [00:20:27]
or connection? I don't think I don't think there are any coincidences
SPEAKER_1 [00:20:30]
at this point in the MCU.
SPEAKER_0 [00:20:32]
Yeah. Listen.
SPEAKER_0 [00:20:33]
Should
SPEAKER_0 [00:20:34]
we spoil this? Should we should we spoil this right now about the vest? Did you read the article I sent you about the vest? Yep. Oh, my gosh. If there were coincidences in the MCU,
SPEAKER_0 [00:20:43]
then the vest
SPEAKER_0 [00:20:44]
that Yelena
SPEAKER_0 [00:20:46]
winds up giving to Black Widow would not be the only thing that Black Widow wears in Endgame.
SPEAKER_0 [00:20:51]
Holy crap. God,
SPEAKER_1 [00:20:52]
what a tearjerker when I read that. Yeah. No. And I mean, there's there's other things like in when we get to the next scene, there is there's Easter eggs there that I think will will pay off in the end. Anyways, next. What's up? Happened next? Alright. So she she gets that. She becomes aware
SPEAKER_0 [00:21:08]
and then she's on the run. We get some Black Widow scenes
SPEAKER_0 [00:21:12]
where she is on her own. Right? So she's escaped to Norway.
SPEAKER_0 [00:21:17]
I can't remember. Do we have the
SPEAKER_0 [00:21:19]
we we have the Ross
SPEAKER_1 [00:21:21]
for her and and she's on the boat. Right? Bingo. So the big thing I think is worth pointing out, we have not seen Thunderbolt Ross in timeline
SPEAKER_1 [00:21:31]
since when?
SPEAKER_1 [00:21:33]
Civil civil war. Right? Okay. So prior to civil war shortly and then Ultron two. Right. He was in and Captain America, Winter Soldier. He was in relatively
SPEAKER_1 [00:21:45]
good
SPEAKER_1 [00:21:46]
shape. Alright?
SPEAKER_1 [00:21:49]
When we see him in Black Widow, what's he what's what's wrong with him? Did he have a double bypass or something? Yeah. He had another he had another bypass. He's walking with a cane.
SPEAKER_1 [00:22:00]
He looks pretty beat up. Alright. Does anyone know who Thunderbolt Ross becomes in the comics? I I don't. I mean, so that's Thunderbolts
SPEAKER_0 [00:22:10]
are a whole thing. Right?
SPEAKER_1 [00:22:11]
No. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. But Thunderbolt Ross becomes the Red Hulk.
SPEAKER_0 [00:22:17]
Oh. Okay.
SPEAKER_0 [00:22:18]
Then it totally makes sense because our first introduction to Ross was from the Incredible Hulk. Right? I don't remember him. Yep. Was he in the original Iron Man?
SPEAKER_1 [00:22:26]
He was at the end of Iron or no. End of Hulk.
SPEAKER_1 [00:22:31]
He was the villain in Hulk or one of the villains other than Abomination and Hulk.
SPEAKER_1 [00:22:35]
And then he's at the end of the Hulk and he's talking to Tony Stark. So do you think that we will get the Red Hulk?
SPEAKER_0 [00:22:42]
I 100% think we're getting the Red Hulk. Oh, man. Okay. Interesting. See there in a second though. I'm not I'm not familiar with that storyline, so you're gonna have to completely take us there. John's over there. Oh, look. John, wake up. Wake up, John. Wake up.
SPEAKER_2 [00:22:54]
I'm I'm just sad that you guys skipped over the opening credits. One that there were opening credits and two how cool they were. So Oh, this smells like teen spirit Which
SPEAKER_2 [00:23:04]
worked excellently. Yeah.
SPEAKER_0 [00:23:06]
For sure. It was it was a good it was good opening credits. I agree. Is there anything else you wanna say about that, John? No. I'm sorry. You you should continue on. You've you've got a meatloaf on the smoker. Alright.
SPEAKER_0 [00:23:18]
So
SPEAKER_0 [00:23:20]
I think I think there's this the way that this is done, this particular scene with the boat,
SPEAKER_0 [00:23:25]
there is this
SPEAKER_0 [00:23:26]
tension that makes you think that Black Widow might go toe to toe with Ross and have a battle,
SPEAKER_0 [00:23:32]
only to find out and I thought this was actually really well done because they they really built this up.
SPEAKER_1 [00:23:37]
She's long gone. Like, she's nowhere near where Ross is. Yeah. Right? I mean, she is always one step ahead.
SPEAKER_1 [00:23:44]
Like, you should not forget that she is always one step ahead. And I I think
SPEAKER_0 [00:23:49]
this is so important in this movie especially, but but just remember about Black Widow. Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:23:55]
She is a
SPEAKER_0 [00:23:57]
she's a killer. She's a spy.
SPEAKER_0 [00:24:00]
She's just got like a a wicked ability to defend herself and get the job done.
SPEAKER_0 [00:24:04]
But it it ultimately
SPEAKER_0 [00:24:06]
is her smarts
SPEAKER_0 [00:24:08]
that makes Black Widow who she is. And it also is probably what sets her apart from the other widows.
SPEAKER_0 [00:24:12]
Right? 100%. Yep. I think we get that in
SPEAKER_0 [00:24:18]
when when her slate is cleared,
SPEAKER_0 [00:24:20]
right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:24:21]
With that whole that whole is that
SPEAKER_0 [00:24:25]
I'm I'm learning all everything together. That's not Winter Soldier, is it?
SPEAKER_0 [00:24:29]
When they they down Hydra, that is Winter Soldier. Yep. Yeah.
SPEAKER_0 [00:24:34]
And so, you get that there, I think, very clearly. You get that a little bit in Iron Man two where she's like, she's teasing Tony. Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:24:43]
The nice thing about this movie is, and this is so critical for the end of it. Right? Her being multiple steps ahead of you as the watcher
SPEAKER_0 [00:24:51]
and the villain
SPEAKER_0 [00:24:53]
is what will ultimately win the day in this movie. Because we I mean, again, we're out we're out of chronological order. We know she's gonna survive. We know that she's gonna win. Right?
SPEAKER_1 [00:25:03]
Yeah. And I I think that's one of the things that make it so successful as
SPEAKER_1 [00:25:07]
the James Bond esque spy movie,
SPEAKER_1 [00:25:11]
is that James Bond is always five steps ahead. And as the movie plays out, they show you how James Bond was manipulating the situation the entire time to his advantage.
SPEAKER_1 [00:25:20]
And they do that very well
SPEAKER_1 [00:25:22]
without,
SPEAKER_0 [00:25:24]
I mean, showing their cards. Like you don't expect to see that in a Marvel movie. So that's why it automatically works. Well, there's yeah. I like I hate to say this because this is you're gonna hate this, but there's a certain predictable
SPEAKER_1 [00:25:35]
elements to a Marvel movie. Right? Oh, 100%. Like Oh, yeah. Mean, you watch it for the enjoyment and the fact that you get to see The character development.
SPEAKER_0 [00:25:45]
John, I
SPEAKER_1 [00:25:48]
like character. The critiques that that big time directors like Scorsese come up with for Marvel movies ring true because they are true.
SPEAKER_1 [00:25:56]
It's not amazing cinema. That's not what you're watching it for. You're not watching it for the Godfather.
SPEAKER_0 [00:26:02]
Right. Right. I think the quintessential example, this is actually the first Avengers movie. Right? Like, you know that they're all gonna have to come together in the end Yep. To have this big final battle, and they're gonna have to, like, forget about themselves, but they will ultimately win. Right? Like, that that movie, that blueprint is essentially
SPEAKER_0 [00:26:19]
how this all works. Now,
SPEAKER_0 [00:26:22]
I what's what's fast so okay. I'm gonna put on my my girl dad hat to quote the late and great Kobe Bryant. Right? Girl dad? Are you familiar with that? Yeah. Yes. Okay. Alright. John John, are you familiar with that? Absolutely. Wow. A sports ball reference that you got. So
SPEAKER_0 [00:26:38]
Go Bucks. I I
SPEAKER_0 [00:26:40]
love that Black Widow in this movie is presented as this, like, truly brilliant,
SPEAKER_0 [00:26:46]
10 steps ahead of the game character.
SPEAKER_0 [00:26:49]
Right? Like, that is the female superhero character that I want my girls
SPEAKER_0 [00:26:54]
to see. They saw that with Captain Marvel and I've I've raved in the past about how much I love Captain Marvel. It's not for everybody, I get it, but like that's the that's the character that I want my girls to look at and and embrace. And so For sure. And she's not hypersexualized
SPEAKER_0 [00:27:09]
or over sexualized or even sexualized at all. Yeah. In fact, I would say that of all of the movies in which she appears, this is the least in which she's sexualized, right? 100%. You you juxtapose this to Iron Man two, where she is literally trying to seduce Tony Stark,
SPEAKER_0 [00:27:24]
and I think it's as far from that as you can get, with the exception of maybe Endgame, because
SPEAKER_0 [00:27:29]
Endgame is also kind of look, we're in that same spectrum of this is the deep,
SPEAKER_0 [00:27:35]
introspective
SPEAKER_0 [00:27:35]
black widow who,
SPEAKER_0 [00:27:37]
you know, yeah, she can she can do awesome stunts, but she also is is gonna defeat you with her mind, you know?
SPEAKER_0 [00:27:47]
Alright. So so we've we've got her with the
SPEAKER_0 [00:27:51]
the boat. She departs. We find her in Norway.
SPEAKER_0 [00:27:55]
She's stocking this house,
SPEAKER_0 [00:27:56]
and
SPEAKER_0 [00:27:58]
John is probably like, who in the world is this Mason guy? Exactly.
SPEAKER_0 [00:28:04]
Thought.
SPEAKER_0 [00:28:05]
Did not. Did you Google it? No. Oh.
SPEAKER_0 [00:28:08]
Patty, tell us about Mason.
SPEAKER_0 [00:28:10]
No. That's you. That's not mine. Are you kidding me? No. Oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_2 [00:28:14]
Alright. So I mean, it's her cue is what I got.
SPEAKER_0 [00:28:19]
Well, okay. So so there's
SPEAKER_0 [00:28:23]
in the in the comics, there are actually two Mason characters. I think they're blending them into
SPEAKER_0 [00:28:29]
the Mason that we get. I don't actually even know if they call him by name. Do they call him by name?
SPEAKER_0 [00:28:33]
No. Okay. And so I only know that from the IMDB. But immediately, I recognized him because basically,
SPEAKER_0 [00:28:39]
there is this individual. He is British, as you can tell because he's got a beautiful voice. But in the comics, he's actually British. And it turns out that he is like a protege of Nick Fury, and he also like has this ability to acquire amazing tech.
SPEAKER_0 [00:28:54]
And he becomes like this sourcing point
SPEAKER_0 [00:28:57]
for heroes in the comic universe.
SPEAKER_0 [00:28:59]
And and like honestly, I did not possibly envision him coming into play here, but he does. And so he becomes the the method by which Black Widow gets all the cool gear that she needs to do her job. So
SPEAKER_0 [00:29:13]
this is a 120%
SPEAKER_0 [00:29:15]
a nod
SPEAKER_0 [00:29:16]
to the comic nerds. Right? Because this is a pretty deep lore character.
SPEAKER_0 [00:29:20]
He happens to allow them to move the story along very quickly. Right? You don't have to explain
SPEAKER_0 [00:29:26]
how she gets a Quinjet. Right? Because Mason just gives it to her.
SPEAKER_0 [00:29:30]
I But I think there is an opportunity for him. I'm hoping that he will come back in in future iterations of the MCU
SPEAKER_1 [00:29:38]
and kinda be like this go to. But I think the way to think of him is like the British Nick Fury. Right? It's the agent. I did not even they did this so well I did not realize who they were actually Who did you think it was? It's the agent. I didn't no. Didn't even think that. No. But I mean, but that's impressive. It is. Like that's another one of those like little bitty Easter eggs
SPEAKER_1 [00:29:58]
that I mean, like, I've read a lot of comics, don't get me wrong, but like I just Wikipedia
SPEAKER_0 [00:30:03]
this and I was like, oh. So I'm So he's he's super smart. Right? Like these are skills.
SPEAKER_0 [00:30:09]
He's got a high level of durability.
SPEAKER_0 [00:30:12]
He also is like a crazy good fighter. Now, thing that I kept wondering this whole movie is like,
SPEAKER_0 [00:30:18]
how did Black Widow meet him? Because he's not in the shield fold if I recall. Correct me if I'm wrong, Patty.
SPEAKER_0 [00:30:25]
Nope. In shield. He's in shield? Okay. Alright. Mhmm. But he he he just kinda sit out like on the periphery, doesn't he?
SPEAKER_0 [00:30:32]
Yes. Yeah. So again, Dick Fury like. Right? And so here's my hope. Here's my prediction.
SPEAKER_0 [00:30:38]
Right? Obviously, Samuel L. Jackson is an older dude.
SPEAKER_0 [00:30:41]
Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:30:42]
Nick Fury has been cast
SPEAKER_0 [00:30:44]
in Samuel L. Jackson's image.
SPEAKER_0 [00:30:47]
I am hoping
SPEAKER_0 [00:30:48]
that the future of S. L. D.
SPEAKER_0 [00:30:51]
In the MCU is led by the agent or Mason.
SPEAKER_1 [00:30:56]
Oh, I think there's a possibility. I wouldn't be so let down if we didn't see him back in Secret Invasion. Oh, yeah. Yeah. You mean Mason or Samuel Jackson? Mason. Well, both of them, but Mason. I I mean,
SPEAKER_0 [00:31:09]
I could see them bringing him back and he's relatively well known in television too. There has to be a hand off. Right? It's not like, again, this is my theory. This is my fan theory. You're hearing it here live for the first time.
SPEAKER_0 [00:31:22]
I believe that Nick Fury will pass the mantle onto Mason.
SPEAKER_0 [00:31:26]
Now, whether or not that happens in
SPEAKER_0 [00:31:30]
what would you oh my gosh. I just blanked. Sigger wars. Sigger wars. Or not, I do not know. But I'm hopeful.
SPEAKER_0 [00:31:37]
Alright.
SPEAKER_0 [00:31:37]
So he's stalking
SPEAKER_0 [00:31:42]
Black Widow with gear. She winds up getting some mail through him
SPEAKER_0 [00:31:47]
from it was up it was the Budapest house.
SPEAKER_1 [00:31:51]
Right? Yep. Yep. Which has been a little easter egg throughout Oh, yeah. The MCU
SPEAKER_1 [00:31:57]
of how
SPEAKER_1 [00:31:59]
Black Widow and
SPEAKER_0 [00:32:01]
and Hawkeye kinda came together. And and I honestly thought that we might actually see what that was in this movie but we didn't. I actually think what they did was better. We saw a little bit. We saw a little bit of Right.
SPEAKER_0 [00:32:13]
The the flashback with the daughter. But but I actually think what they did was better. Right? That to continue to talk about it like, we would have had to eject from the timeline that that that they were operating in in order to tell that story. And we know how much John doesn't like that from WandaVision. Right? Where things are not not sequential. Right, John?
SPEAKER_2 [00:32:30]
I it's not so much that they're sequential, it's whether they transition it well or not. Alright. So we only had two hours, so they weren't gonna transition Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:32:39]
But
SPEAKER_0 [00:32:41]
suffice to say that this is we we learned this is exactly how
SPEAKER_0 [00:32:45]
she defects to shield.
SPEAKER_0 [00:32:47]
Right? We find out that all happened in Budapest, and she gets this package from some safe house that I guess she used in conjunction with Mason. Like there is so much intertwined with this. I think they did a good job of presenting it in an approachable way for those that are not deep in the MCU though. Yep. It's important, but it's not that important. Right. It is not the most important. But guys like us, we're nerd not about it. Right? Like I'm I'm like, oh my gosh, oh my gosh, it's Budapest.
SPEAKER_0 [00:33:14]
The
SPEAKER_0 [00:33:15]
this winds up setting up how
SPEAKER_0 [00:33:17]
Yelena
SPEAKER_0 [00:33:19]
and the Black Widow
SPEAKER_0 [00:33:21]
will meet Natasha.
SPEAKER_0 [00:33:22]
How how Yelena and Natasha will meet
SPEAKER_0 [00:33:24]
for the first time since Ohio, I guess. Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:33:27]
Yep. Yep. Cuba technically but Cuba. Yeah. Yeah. Ohio,
SPEAKER_0 [00:33:32]
Cuba, same difference. Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:33:35]
Both the last place that anybody wants to travel to. That's still one thing they have in common.
SPEAKER_0 [00:33:40]
Valid point. So we
SPEAKER_0 [00:33:42]
wind up, she's got these tubes, she goes into town because her generator, her well stocked generator runs out of gas.
SPEAKER_0 [00:33:49]
She gets hit by a missile,
SPEAKER_0 [00:33:51]
and then we are introduced to Patty.
SPEAKER_1 [00:33:54]
The most disappointing villain in the MCU.
SPEAKER_0 [00:33:57]
I I will say I I think they could have done more.
SPEAKER_1 [00:34:02]
This
SPEAKER_1 [00:34:04]
is
SPEAKER_1 [00:34:05]
my least
SPEAKER_1 [00:34:08]
the movie is good.
SPEAKER_1 [00:34:10]
Right? I really enjoyed the movie So don't get me wrong. But
SPEAKER_1 [00:34:14]
the way they misuse villains and make plot devices out of genuine
SPEAKER_1 [00:34:20]
big time villains
SPEAKER_0 [00:34:21]
is so disappointing. Yeah. Okay. So this is this is Dreykov's daughter. What what is her villain name?
SPEAKER_0 [00:34:28]
Taskmaster.
SPEAKER_0 [00:34:29]
Taskmaster.
SPEAKER_0 [00:34:30]
Yeah. Yeah. That's where we go.
SPEAKER_0 [00:34:32]
Who is the biggest Hawkeye villain? Right. 100% the biggest Hawkeye villain. Weird because of how this movie ends.
SPEAKER_0 [00:34:39]
Right? No. Yeah. But we'll we'll get there. We'll get there. So so I have I have I have some some ideas about that but I'm looking forward to hearing those. So Taskmaster
SPEAKER_0 [00:34:48]
flips over Black Widow's truck,
SPEAKER_0 [00:34:51]
they go toe to toe. We get the first taste of the fact that taskmaster can mimic
SPEAKER_0 [00:34:56]
everything
SPEAKER_0 [00:34:57]
that Natasha does.
SPEAKER_0 [00:34:59]
Right? Natasha only escapes because she falls into the water.
SPEAKER_1 [00:35:03]
That's Keeping in mind that taskmaster is also fighting like Captain America throughout the entire fight while mimicking her. Oh, interesting. It's it's not just the shield like he's using Captain America moves
SPEAKER_0 [00:35:15]
while they're Did you pick up on that, John? Absolutely.
SPEAKER_0 [00:35:18]
Oh, I'm not sure that I totally saw that. Yeah. Okay. Well, I well, again, I'll embrace it. I'm I'm I'm open. Like, the the signature Captain America like jump bash sort of thing is very prevalent.
SPEAKER_1 [00:35:30]
Okay. That's totally fair. That's totally fair. And then he mimics her double kicks and
SPEAKER_0 [00:35:36]
things like that too. I I will say, having not noticed all these particulars,
SPEAKER_0 [00:35:40]
yeah, I thought it was pretty well choreographed.
SPEAKER_1 [00:35:42]
Right? Oh, 100%.
SPEAKER_1 [00:35:44]
The amount I mean, so much of the movie was done with practical effects
SPEAKER_1 [00:35:49]
compared to other Marvel movies that really sold the point.
SPEAKER_1 [00:35:55]
Like the most special effects occurs in like the rescue scene and at the end
SPEAKER_1 [00:36:00]
in the red room and things like that. But for the most part, there's a lot of practical effects which was really impressive. Yeah. No. No. I think that's actually a good call out. I had not thought
SPEAKER_0 [00:36:09]
about that explicitly until you said it, but until the red room come really comes crashing down,
SPEAKER_0 [00:36:15]
we we are mostly not in CGI territory, I think. Yeah.
SPEAKER_0 [00:36:20]
On Sure there's enhancement. Right?
SPEAKER_1 [00:36:22]
But from what the the Red Guardian rescue is all CGI. Sure.
SPEAKER_1 [00:36:27]
There's no way to do that practical.
SPEAKER_1 [00:36:29]
But otherwise,
SPEAKER_1 [00:36:30]
I mean, car chases and motorcycle chases
SPEAKER_1 [00:36:32]
outside of the flips, even with the flips, the flips might have very well been done,
SPEAKER_1 [00:36:39]
with practical effects too. I was pretty impressed by that. That's not usual.
SPEAKER_0 [00:36:43]
So,
SPEAKER_0 [00:36:44]
okay. We we get that interaction.
SPEAKER_0 [00:36:46]
She
SPEAKER_0 [00:36:49]
like, she she determines that
SPEAKER_0 [00:36:51]
taskmaster
SPEAKER_0 [00:36:52]
wants a package, not her. Right? Which she seems surprised by. I'm guessing she thinks that Ross is behind this until she realizes that he's not.
SPEAKER_1 [00:37:02]
Yeah. She manages Yeah. Because at this point, she would not know who taskmaster Right. So she gets the
SPEAKER_0 [00:37:07]
the thingies,
SPEAKER_0 [00:37:08]
the tubes.
SPEAKER_0 [00:37:10]
Right? She falls in the water, she escapes, and she goes to Budapest
SPEAKER_0 [00:37:14]
to the safe house where the mail was dropped off. Right?
SPEAKER_1 [00:37:18]
Because
SPEAKER_1 [00:37:19]
why did she go to Budapest?
SPEAKER_0 [00:37:21]
I'm assuming because that's where the mail came from.
SPEAKER_0 [00:37:24]
Picture. Oh, that's right. Right. With the tubes The The
SPEAKER_0 [00:37:28]
picture was on the with his sister. Of her and Yelena when they were kids. Now, here's here's what I don't understand. That's that's a great call out.
SPEAKER_0 [00:37:34]
What
SPEAKER_0 [00:37:35]
about
SPEAKER_0 [00:37:36]
the picture would make her go to Budapest Just because the mail came from there and it's like, oh, something important is going on or was there something else? Yeah. I think I think it was the tubes in the Budapest mail
SPEAKER_1 [00:37:49]
with the picture
SPEAKER_1 [00:37:50]
led her there. Okay. I honestly I mean, that might be a weak point of the plot for Yelena to be like, why did you come?
SPEAKER_0 [00:37:57]
Oh, yeah. Yeah. You weren't supposed to come. You know what I mean? But like, what is the obvious conclusion? You know what I mean? Right. So Black Widow shows up and this was a trailer scene that that we had seen several different cuts of.
SPEAKER_0 [00:38:08]
She
SPEAKER_0 [00:38:09]
interacts with Yelena.
SPEAKER_0 [00:38:11]
They go toe to toe.
SPEAKER_0 [00:38:13]
It seems like there's some like legit
SPEAKER_0 [00:38:15]
anger between them
SPEAKER_0 [00:38:17]
and Yep. And it so it went so long that I initially thought,
SPEAKER_0 [00:38:21]
oh, this is just them playing around.
SPEAKER_0 [00:38:23]
But then it went a little farther. I was like, maybe they're not playing around. Maybe she actually wants to kill her.
SPEAKER_1 [00:38:28]
Yep.
SPEAKER_1 [00:38:29]
Which I think was actually like, it was it was the friendly sibling fight and then it they started slamming each other through cabinets and then a knife is pulled and then that's when it gets Right. Yeah. That's good. That's when Thanksgiving dinner just goes Right. Down the street. Like we've all done with our siblings. Right? Well,
SPEAKER_0 [00:38:45]
Patty, you don't have any siblings, right? It's just you Yeah. Yeah. I do. Alright. So Johnny. Johnny, you know that when like you get to that point where you're punching the crap out of your sibling and you're like, ugh,
SPEAKER_0 [00:38:55]
and and you realize you've now gone too far, that was it in a nutshell. Right.
SPEAKER_2 [00:39:00]
Fun fact that
SPEAKER_2 [00:39:01]
I still have mental superiority
SPEAKER_2 [00:39:05]
over my brother. Like, he could definitely take me in a fight, but as the older brother, like, I just have that advantage.
SPEAKER_0 [00:39:12]
There's there's no chance he listens to the podcast, is there? No. No way.
SPEAKER_0 [00:39:20]
What's what are the chances that Liz is, like, texting him? Hey. You need to listen to this episode. Probably also slim. She might text me though. I don't know if she'll listen to the black one. Yeah. She'll skip this episode because it's about Marvel stuff.
SPEAKER_0 [00:39:32]
Alright. So we are we get a clue that Taskmaster has some pretty keen ability to follow or to track
SPEAKER_0 [00:39:40]
because
SPEAKER_0 [00:39:41]
Mhmm. She
SPEAKER_0 [00:39:42]
is suddenly there.
SPEAKER_0 [00:39:45]
They
SPEAKER_0 [00:39:46]
escape like
SPEAKER_0 [00:39:48]
just barely. Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:39:50]
And,
SPEAKER_0 [00:39:51]
I'm fast forwarding quite a bit here. But fundamentally,
SPEAKER_0 [00:39:55]
we, we get to a situation where
SPEAKER_0 [00:39:58]
they're going to decide to go get their dad.
SPEAKER_0 [00:40:02]
Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:40:03]
Am I missing important parts before they decide on the family reunion?
SPEAKER_1 [00:40:08]
Well, they believe that he's going to know the location of the Red Room. That's the whole so the way. So the the goal is to look for the Red Room.
SPEAKER_1 [00:40:16]
Yelena informs Natasha that the
SPEAKER_1 [00:40:20]
vials are the solution to the mind control
SPEAKER_1 [00:40:23]
that Dreykov has implemented to control the widows.
SPEAKER_1 [00:40:27]
Thus, his best friend,
SPEAKER_1 [00:40:29]
the Red Guardian,
SPEAKER_1 [00:40:30]
the hope of mother Russia of the Soviet Union, must know
SPEAKER_2 [00:40:34]
where the Red Room actually is located. The the other big important thing there is that Natasha thinks that Grakov is dead and the Red Room no longer exists. So then she comes to the realization that that hadn't happened. Yep. Right. Which She did not actually kill him and then that's where the Budapest reveal
SPEAKER_0 [00:40:52]
is Yeah. So this is the kind of full circle.
SPEAKER_0 [00:40:55]
Her ability to defect to shield, she had to take out Dreykov,
SPEAKER_0 [00:40:59]
so she thought.
SPEAKER_0 [00:41:01]
I how did you feel about the fact that she blew up the building
SPEAKER_0 [00:41:05]
but didn't go check for bodies? Did that that check out with you?
SPEAKER_1 [00:41:12]
I mean, I think that's the normal Marvel plot hole. You just kinda look over it and then you don't move on. Also, if you think about it, like if you're a spy,
SPEAKER_1 [00:41:20]
are you really going to have time to to sweep the building and check for the remaining Was
SPEAKER_2 [00:41:25]
the young daughter that you based that he was there off of, like Yeah. And that that part is fair. But I would say like,
SPEAKER_0 [00:41:32]
you know, as a paid killer, you verify.
SPEAKER_0 [00:41:35]
Right? Because that's part of how you get paid. So I I gotta think that's like Dreykoff was never gonna let her take somebody out without verifying. Right? Right. Yeah. I mean, I I I like to think that she she pushed the button, blew the building and she was on the plane
SPEAKER_1 [00:41:48]
that was waiting on the runway to The United States for it to defect. But she wasn't because they'll use the hiding place
SPEAKER_0 [00:41:55]
again,
SPEAKER_0 [00:41:55]
right?
SPEAKER_1 [00:41:56]
Because they were there for three days.
SPEAKER_1 [00:41:59]
Look man,
SPEAKER_1 [00:42:00]
we're just pulling the potholes out. They're
SPEAKER_1 [00:42:03]
gonna they're gonna cancel us. So
SPEAKER_0 [00:42:06]
so we get to this point though
SPEAKER_0 [00:42:08]
where
SPEAKER_0 [00:42:09]
they determine that they're gonna they're gonna go through the people that they know.
SPEAKER_0 [00:42:13]
Somehow they find out that the Red Guardian is in prison.
SPEAKER_0 [00:42:17]
It it really isn't until we see the Red Guardian in prison that we get
SPEAKER_0 [00:42:21]
a clear
SPEAKER_0 [00:42:23]
again, if you don't know the comics, a clear picture of him being
SPEAKER_0 [00:42:26]
the Captain America
SPEAKER_0 [00:42:27]
counterpart
SPEAKER_0 [00:42:29]
for Mother Russia.
SPEAKER_0 [00:42:30]
Right? Yep. Mhmm. He's got the super soldier serum,
SPEAKER_0 [00:42:34]
and I all I could think of is, the the way the MCU talks about the super serum, it's like, we couldn't reproduce it. Except it's been reproduced a lot of times. Right. Right? So I was in Falcon and the Winter Soldier, one of the best parts of that series. Right. Yep. Maybe the only good part, arguably.
SPEAKER_0 [00:42:50]
But and so so we know I wouldn't go that far.
SPEAKER_0 [00:42:54]
We know that that Russia's done this. We know that Hydra has done this.
SPEAKER_0 [00:42:59]
Oh, here's an interesting kinda tidbit that that bothered me a little bit. If I recall, Red Room is tangent to Leviathan,
SPEAKER_0 [00:43:06]
but we don't get a single Leviathan rest reference in this movie.
SPEAKER_0 [00:43:11]
That that bothers me. I feel like this is
SPEAKER_0 [00:43:14]
one of the great uncapitalized
SPEAKER_0 [00:43:16]
avenues
SPEAKER_0 [00:43:17]
for the MCU. And John,
SPEAKER_0 [00:43:20]
you should get the Leviathan reference if you watched agent agent Carter.
SPEAKER_2 [00:43:25]
I No. Do? Maybe. Kind of. I did watch I agent
SPEAKER_2 [00:43:29]
remember Leviathan. That was season one. Right? Yes.
SPEAKER_0 [00:43:33]
It was season one, because season two is garbage and not worth watching. But basically,
SPEAKER_0 [00:43:36]
Leviathan, right, is the is the Hydra
SPEAKER_0 [00:43:40]
of Russia,
SPEAKER_0 [00:43:42]
and there's like a whole there's a whole parallel track that goes on
SPEAKER_0 [00:43:45]
with that group.
SPEAKER_0 [00:43:47]
And we have only scraped the surface of it with Asian Carter, and then they threw that all away.
SPEAKER_0 [00:43:52]
Again, the Red Room sits tangential to it, but but we didn't touch on that. So I'm still hopeful that maybe,
SPEAKER_0 [00:43:59]
just maybe, we'll get some of that at some point. But yeah.
SPEAKER_1 [00:44:04]
I think they're
SPEAKER_1 [00:44:05]
operating under the fact that agent Carter never actually happened. I know. I'm still bitter about that though.
SPEAKER_1 [00:44:11]
And they're saving Leviathan for something else, which is also something I'm gonna bring up later. Oh, we're getting I've got a whole list of things. Alright.
SPEAKER_2 [00:44:20]
How's the meatloaf doing, Stan? 132
SPEAKER_0 [00:44:23]
degrees. I gotta paint it at one forty and supposedly
SPEAKER_0 [00:44:26]
Alright. Via text, missus Lemon is good to go. So Nice. I turned the heat down a little bit on the smoker which should produce more smoke.
SPEAKER_0 [00:44:33]
I go on and on.
SPEAKER_0 [00:44:36]
So they go to get pick up the Red Guardian. We get a taste of him in prison. We don't actually know why he's in prison though. Not not clearly like Apparently Initially, no. Yeah. Yeah. Not at that point. Dreykov apparently turned on him, right, at some point and threw him in prison? Is that As soon as he got back from Cuba. Which
SPEAKER_0 [00:44:52]
again like why is the thing I wanna know.
SPEAKER_0 [00:44:55]
And and I don't I don't remember does is Dreykov responsible for him having the super soldier serum?
SPEAKER_1 [00:45:03]
I don't I don't think so. Right? I think he had he yeah. Well, I mean, he had the super soldier serum well before. So he Dre I I think at that point, Dreykov is just kind of
SPEAKER_1 [00:45:13]
parallel to him being Yeah. Okay. Red Guardian. Alright. And so
SPEAKER_0 [00:45:18]
we have, I I think, pretty cool
SPEAKER_0 [00:45:22]
breakout scene. Right? This is
SPEAKER_0 [00:45:26]
again, like, is nothing fancy in terms of storytelling.
SPEAKER_0 [00:45:30]
It's it's super messy though. Right? And this is where you get to see all the superhero elements of both Natasha,
SPEAKER_0 [00:45:37]
Yelena,
SPEAKER_0 [00:45:38]
right? And Mhmm. Also the Red Guardian. I can't remember. Is this where Yelena first starts trolling Natasha about the pose?
SPEAKER_2 [00:45:47]
Yeah.
SPEAKER_2 [00:45:48]
Like Yeah. It's before that because when she actually jumps down you
SPEAKER_1 [00:45:52]
Yeah. Because yeah. They're talking about they were talking about it in the house when it was just the two of them. Yeah. You're such a poser. And then Such a poser. Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_0 [00:46:01]
That I I enjoyed all of that. I don't know that that's super consequential other than we get to the helicopter. Right? And I think the helicopter scene is super important when all three of them are there.
SPEAKER_0 [00:46:12]
Because one, I think we realized that Yelena and Natasha do not like this man. Right? Yeah.
SPEAKER_1 [00:46:19]
And it it establishes that they're not actually family too at that point, I believe. Yeah. Because the beginning is is
SPEAKER_1 [00:46:27]
kind It's little fuzzy. Leads to it, but it's still fuzzy enough that needs to be established that they are not family. And and so they
SPEAKER_0 [00:46:35]
the the other thing I thought was awesome
SPEAKER_0 [00:46:38]
is you have like the most chauvinistic
SPEAKER_0 [00:46:41]
sexist persona
SPEAKER_0 [00:46:42]
in the Red Guardian. Right? And you get to see that when he blames
SPEAKER_0 [00:46:46]
their attitudes for being quote that time of the month. Right? Yeah. And then apparently, this was this was ad libbed. I I read about this. Helena starts talking about
SPEAKER_0 [00:46:57]
how that can't happen because the red room
SPEAKER_0 [00:46:59]
sterilizes them. We actually know this from
SPEAKER_0 [00:47:04]
this
SPEAKER_0 [00:47:05]
it's not so Ultron. Thank you. This is from Ultron where we get the reference where Natasha talks about being sterilized. She's having that conversation with Banner.
SPEAKER_0 [00:47:13]
Right? But but Yelena's like, they literally cut out my ovaries and like all these she goes through the whole process. Right? And it's like it's like, holy cats. And as uncomfortable as you feel, the Red Guardian manages to show on screen. Feels it too. So what I love about this is like you've got this super intoxicating dose of chauvinism. Right? And then Yelena just dissolves that, like just it's gone.
SPEAKER_0 [00:47:35]
And and so, you know, she they they honestly overshadow the Red Guardian, and then they lay out their plan. Right? And they're gonna go
SPEAKER_0 [00:47:42]
see
SPEAKER_0 [00:47:43]
Molina
SPEAKER_0 [00:47:46]
with the pigs. Like what when the world I've been on a pig farm, I guess. Oh my god. So weird. So strange.
SPEAKER_1 [00:47:53]
At this this is the point of the movie where I mean I think every
SPEAKER_1 [00:47:57]
double o seven movie and spy movie kinda has that
SPEAKER_1 [00:48:01]
little bit of a lull in the middle where there's so much story development.
SPEAKER_1 [00:48:06]
I enjoyed it
SPEAKER_0 [00:48:08]
but this is by far the weakest part of the movie. I think it serves two purpose. One, they have to get Molina involved in order to execute on the the final arc.
SPEAKER_0 [00:48:18]
Yeah. Right? But the other thing is, like, let's be candid. This existed for that dinner table scene.
SPEAKER_1 [00:48:24]
Right? Yeah. For sure.
SPEAKER_0 [00:48:26]
Yep. And so,
SPEAKER_0 [00:48:27]
which I thought was comical, but it also gave this it was it was comedy and also just like serious interaction around
SPEAKER_0 [00:48:36]
identifying who these characters are, their relationships to each other, and also
SPEAKER_0 [00:48:41]
the significance of now being on their own, and what it's going to mean to topple down the Red Room. Right? Dreykov has
SPEAKER_0 [00:48:48]
has destroyed each of these people, even Melina, because she seems to have seriously cared about this family that was ripped away from her, you know?
SPEAKER_1 [00:48:57]
Yeah. I mean, she she knew no other. Natasha was born in or not born in, but in Russia. She knows
SPEAKER_1 [00:49:05]
about the history. She it seemed as though she had been to the Red Room or she knew of the Red Room
SPEAKER_1 [00:49:12]
up until that point.
SPEAKER_1 [00:49:14]
Molina only knew Ohio. Right. Right. And then life became hell. Yep.
SPEAKER_0 [00:49:20]
And so they will get snatched up by Dreykov's Goonies
SPEAKER_0 [00:49:25]
and loaded onto a plane,
SPEAKER_0 [00:49:27]
and
SPEAKER_0 [00:49:27]
we really have no clue at this point that Melina is anything other than a bad black widow or a bad widow. I shouldn't say black widow, bad widow. Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:49:38]
This is also the first indication we get of where the Red Room is.
SPEAKER_0 [00:49:41]
Anybody surprised?
SPEAKER_2 [00:49:45]
Of flying fortress.
SPEAKER_0 [00:49:46]
Yeah. I mean, like,
SPEAKER_0 [00:49:48]
this is Marvel's go to people do. Right? They either go to the ocean or they go to the sky.
SPEAKER_1 [00:49:54]
And I mean, this is
SPEAKER_1 [00:49:56]
you guys have talked in the past about how and Jon especially, you don't like
SPEAKER_1 [00:50:01]
when
SPEAKER_1 [00:50:02]
characters
SPEAKER_1 [00:50:03]
kinda teeter between good and bad like Loki. Loki is a bad guy, but and Loki, if you watch Loki, he's clearly finding
SPEAKER_1 [00:50:10]
the light. Right? That's
SPEAKER_1 [00:50:11]
just a com it's just a it's
SPEAKER_1 [00:50:14]
a comic trope. Right? It's always. Yeah. Bad guys are also good guys, and good guys can also be bad guys. One of the biggest Black Panther villains is Namor
SPEAKER_1 [00:50:24]
who is also an Avenger. Yeah.
SPEAKER_1 [00:50:28]
And I mean and that's same thing this is Marvel fully embracing the comic
SPEAKER_1 [00:50:33]
trope of Flying Fortress
SPEAKER_1 [00:50:35]
and that makes me really happy.
SPEAKER_0 [00:50:38]
So Like just do
SPEAKER_0 [00:50:41]
it. Why not? They got big and bold with the red room. Right? This was though dinky Yeah. Little room floating around up there. Yeah. For sure. So let me let me just clarify. Do you think that Melina
SPEAKER_0 [00:50:52]
was bad from the word go when they arrived at the house or
SPEAKER_0 [00:50:56]
do you think
SPEAKER_0 [00:50:58]
that we just didn't see them plot out what she was going to do?
SPEAKER_0 [00:51:04]
Well, I think it's kinda showing that we didn't see we didn't see the plot. No. But like We saw Let me let me back up. When she calls for Dreykov to come get them,
SPEAKER_1 [00:51:12]
is she doing that with the plot already in play or Yeah. Think no. I think she called when she saw them walking up. They have the kitchen table scene and she realized that she had made a mistake. Okay.
SPEAKER_0 [00:51:24]
Alright.
SPEAKER_2 [00:51:25]
That's what I thought too.
SPEAKER_0 [00:51:27]
I waffled back and forth on this. I think it could go either way. Melina is
SPEAKER_0 [00:51:32]
this super awkward
SPEAKER_0 [00:51:34]
intelligent
SPEAKER_0 [00:51:35]
scientist.
SPEAKER_0 [00:51:36]
Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:51:38]
The pig stuff was amusing, not substantive in my opinion.
SPEAKER_0 [00:51:43]
But but so we we take we we we find out that
SPEAKER_0 [00:51:47]
the Red Room is floating in the sky. They land,
SPEAKER_0 [00:51:51]
and I guess, they
SPEAKER_0 [00:51:53]
they decide they're gonna dissect Yelena's brain. We meet modern day Dreykov,
SPEAKER_0 [00:51:58]
and
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:00]
we we get an emotional
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:02]
Red Guardian in the room.
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:04]
He's like pouring his heart out, showing that he's not a total, you know, jerk.
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:11]
Ultimately,
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:12]
right, I think
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:14]
that
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:16]
we we learned that Melina and
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:18]
Natasha
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:20]
have tripped everybody up when what appears to be Natasha or excuse me, what appears to be Melina
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:26]
removes from her face
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:28]
the same thing that we've seen Natasha use before
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:31]
in Civil War. It's
SPEAKER_1 [00:52:33]
the same tag. Yep. The Nano Yeah. Mask. Yep.
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:36]
And
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:38]
then
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:39]
I'm I'm gonna jump around a bit here. But them then commences the
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:43]
attempt to strike Dreykov where we learn about the pheromone protection.
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:47]
Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:49]
Which
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:50]
we're we're constantly building up this persona of this insecure man in Dreykov
SPEAKER_0 [00:52:55]
on so many levels. But I think like this is really the the height of it.
SPEAKER_1 [00:52:59]
Yeah. I think it's easy to dismiss it as a cheesy plot device.
SPEAKER_1 [00:53:05]
But when you actually get into it, the purpose behind the pheromone protection is is pretty powerful. Like, he ultimately is afraid of his own creation because his own creation could very,
SPEAKER_1 [00:53:18]
very quickly
SPEAKER_1 [00:53:20]
absolutely
SPEAKER_0 [00:53:21]
murder him. So he has to install something that's going to protect him from him. Yep. And and to go back to what we discussed earlier. Right? Black Widow has to think 10 steps ahead.
SPEAKER_0 [00:53:30]
Dreykov is attempting to think maybe two steps ahead. Right? And this this movie presents him as
SPEAKER_0 [00:53:37]
being that forward thinker. Right? Like analyzing the situation, getting ahead of the the enemy, but
SPEAKER_0 [00:53:43]
you know, unless unless you've not been paying attention, you know Black Widow is gonna one up him, probably in a big way.
SPEAKER_1 [00:53:49]
Yeah. And I think it's impressive too when you think about how forward thinking he is. She's been deprogrammed
SPEAKER_1 [00:53:57]
for at by this point for at least ten plus years,
SPEAKER_1 [00:54:02]
maybe a little shorter. So he was so forth thinking in her programming and in her psychological
SPEAKER_1 [00:54:08]
training since she wasn't chemically altered
SPEAKER_1 [00:54:10]
since
SPEAKER_1 [00:54:11]
the late nineties Yep. The or mid nineties to late nineties. That's that's forward thinking.
SPEAKER_0 [00:54:17]
But the hero is that much more forward thinking. Yep. And again, goes back to, I think Natasha's strengths. Now, her other strength right is she's just she's tough as nails.
SPEAKER_0 [00:54:29]
And so when it comes time to deal with the pheromone situation,
SPEAKER_0 [00:54:32]
she does like the most
SPEAKER_1 [00:54:35]
tough thing I could think of. Right? She severs the nerve in her nose. Yeah. I I I when we Amanda and I were watching it, as soon as she started antagonizing him to get her him to punch her. I was like, she's trying to get him to break her nose. And it happened over and and I was thinking this is so perfect.
SPEAKER_1 [00:54:52]
And then the fact that he couldn't do it and that was the payoff made it so much better. So the the fact that he couldn't do it, I think played into this this fact that
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:03]
he he is actually weak. He's very insecure. Right? That's why he's created all these Yeah. Things around him. And he's not he's he's, like, so he's
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:11]
so weak.
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:12]
He cannot break like, this is how it's presented. He cannot break a woman's nose, you know?
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:17]
I thought it was great. I like, it it was the right juxtaposition
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:21]
to set her up.
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:23]
What we what we didn't find, right, is he he does
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:27]
seem to escape.
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:30]
The the interesting thing to me is
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:32]
for most of this movie,
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:34]
I genuinely believed
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:36]
that Natasha was going to kill Dreykov.
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:39]
Like that was the trajectory that she had. Mhmm. She was gonna like right that wrong.
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:44]
We will end this movie and she will not have killed Dreykov.
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:47]
Yep. Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:50]
Pretty interesting fight with the rest of the widows.
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:54]
They get cured, thanks to Yelena.
SPEAKER_0 [00:55:57]
I think we are quickly getting
SPEAKER_0 [00:56:00]
tripped into believing that Yelena's gonna be
SPEAKER_0 [00:56:03]
a good guy. Right?
SPEAKER_0 [00:56:06]
I'm not entirely sure we're supposed to walk away with that, but we'll get there.
SPEAKER_0 [00:56:11]
So
SPEAKER_0 [00:56:12]
the Melina will destroy the red room. The red room will be toppling down.
SPEAKER_0 [00:56:17]
Natasha has a like almost reconciliation
SPEAKER_0 [00:56:20]
moment with taskmaster,
SPEAKER_0 [00:56:23]
which again I think,
SPEAKER_0 [00:56:24]
I don't know. Taskmaster
SPEAKER_0 [00:56:26]
should have gotten away
SPEAKER_0 [00:56:27]
and should have been
SPEAKER_1 [00:56:30]
An actual villain. Yeah. I think the Not
SPEAKER_1 [00:56:33]
it's pure plot device. The same thing happened to Ghost and Ant Man.
SPEAKER_1 [00:56:38]
Yep. Like, these are good quality villains
SPEAKER_1 [00:56:43]
that just haven't been used. And I
SPEAKER_1 [00:56:46]
I know I strongly
SPEAKER_1 [00:56:48]
believe, we'll get there in a second, that there's a plan in place for these types of characters,
SPEAKER_0 [00:56:54]
but it's still unfortunate to see. Yeah. I'd it's a I think
SPEAKER_0 [00:56:58]
a misuse of the depth of the IP that they have in the character. I I don't know how to say like that's
SPEAKER_1 [00:57:04]
that that's Yep. I think they wanna get some they have such a drive to do big story development
SPEAKER_1 [00:57:11]
that they can't find story development in villains like Taskmaster.
SPEAKER_1 [00:57:16]
There's not a lot there. There's not a lot that they already have to build on maybe for where they wanna go in the story. So they have to use them more of a plot device
SPEAKER_1 [00:57:24]
than anything else. Yep.
SPEAKER_0 [00:57:26]
So okay. We find ourselves with Yelena destroying
SPEAKER_0 [00:57:31]
a
SPEAKER_0 [00:57:33]
helicopter
SPEAKER_0 [00:57:33]
that Dreykov is on. We think that she's going to die. I mean, sure it seems like a sacrificial moment.
SPEAKER_0 [00:57:41]
She's kind of glib about it.
SPEAKER_0 [00:57:43]
Natasha will save her. Dreykov will die.
SPEAKER_0 [00:57:48]
I think then it becomes
SPEAKER_0 [00:57:51]
I I let me let me say this.
SPEAKER_0 [00:57:54]
We by the end of this movie, we have to resolve Dreykov.
SPEAKER_0 [00:57:57]
We have to resolve Taskmaster,
SPEAKER_0 [00:58:00]
and we also
SPEAKER_0 [00:58:02]
have to
SPEAKER_0 [00:58:04]
end the Red Room and give the rest of these
SPEAKER_0 [00:58:07]
these widows purpose.
SPEAKER_0 [00:58:09]
We also have to like send
SPEAKER_0 [00:58:11]
the Red Guardian and Molina off.
SPEAKER_0 [00:58:13]
That's a lot to do. And I I will say I feel like the end was a little bit rushed.
SPEAKER_1 [00:58:20]
Yeah. I think that
SPEAKER_1 [00:58:22]
combining taskmaster
SPEAKER_1 [00:58:23]
and the rest of the widows along with Yelena
SPEAKER_1 [00:58:26]
actually, all of the characters other than Natasha all have a single purpose.
SPEAKER_1 [00:58:31]
Their goal is to find the rest of the widows,
SPEAKER_1 [00:58:34]
synthesize
SPEAKER_1 [00:58:35]
the,
SPEAKER_1 [00:58:36]
the agent, create more, and then make sure all of them are now cured.
SPEAKER_1 [00:58:41]
They all have a they all have a purpose.
SPEAKER_1 [00:58:45]
I I I would be shocked if we saw Melina or Red Guardian again.
SPEAKER_1 [00:58:50]
I think those are kind of just one off characters unless there's some sort of flashback movie. I don't know if they necessarily serve a point.
SPEAKER_0 [00:58:58]
I I The same thing with the rest of the Widows. Yeah. I would love I would I would absolutely love for there to be
SPEAKER_0 [00:59:04]
kind of a Captain America esque style flashback that dealt with the Red Guardian, that dealt with Leviathan. I will not get it. Alright? I'm I'm not gonna get it. Yeah. But I would love that. So
SPEAKER_0 [00:59:16]
that's what Agent Carter season two is gonna be. And if they had just dealt with Leviathan,
SPEAKER_0 [00:59:19]
Agent Carter season two would not have stunk. They would have never scrapped it. And I I'm gonna tell you right here, right now that that is why
SPEAKER_0 [00:59:27]
both Agents of Shield and Agent Carter are not part of the MCU. It's because of Agent Carter season two.
SPEAKER_1 [00:59:33]
Or Agents of Shield season three, four, five, six. Oh, come on. They totally folded it.
SPEAKER_0 [00:59:41]
Alright.
SPEAKER_0 [00:59:43]
So
SPEAKER_0 [00:59:45]
we find ourselves at the end of this movie.
SPEAKER_0 [00:59:48]
What what
SPEAKER_0 [00:59:50]
do you think, Patty?
SPEAKER_1 [00:59:52]
I I mean, I texted you guys after I watched it. It's probably in the mid teens for me. Interesting.
SPEAKER_2 [00:59:59]
I would have expected How many Marvel movies are there now?
SPEAKER_0 [01:00:02]
20 some. 23.
SPEAKER_2 [01:00:04]
So this was by no far no
SPEAKER_2 [01:00:07]
this was no way a bad movie.
SPEAKER_2 [01:00:10]
Like, it's not with Ant Man and the Wasp or anything like that. But don't think I would put it very high on the overall Avengers rankings either.
SPEAKER_0 [01:00:18]
Well, I'd I'm confident I definitely would put it higher than y'all.
SPEAKER_0 [01:00:22]
So
SPEAKER_0 [01:00:22]
I maybe maybe it's just a lull. Maybe that's clouding my judgment, and and I will revisit this when I come and watch it again.
SPEAKER_0 [01:00:29]
I felt like it was different from a Marvel movie.
SPEAKER_0 [01:00:32]
I felt like I wanted to see this story told.
SPEAKER_0 [01:00:36]
I felt like it was
SPEAKER_0 [01:00:38]
a good way of dealing with the origins of Black Widow
SPEAKER_0 [01:00:42]
without actually being an origin story. Right? This is not like Captain America or even Captain Marvel,
SPEAKER_0 [01:00:47]
where you go back in time and you actually see the the origin of the character,
SPEAKER_0 [01:00:52]
and yet we get the origin story through it all. I think it's also a really great way to introduce Yelena into the MCU
SPEAKER_0 [01:00:58]
and whatever that possibly means.
SPEAKER_0 [01:01:00]
Right? I think it's pretty impressive that they managed to do this without any of the other Avengers
SPEAKER_0 [01:01:05]
in the movie. Right? Like it it genuinely
SPEAKER_0 [01:01:09]
stood on the shoulders of Scarlett Johansson.
SPEAKER_0 [01:01:13]
Yes.
SPEAKER_0 [01:01:14]
It was only two hours, which meant that I did not actually have to pause it to go potty.
SPEAKER_0 [01:01:18]
That that was a big win.
SPEAKER_0 [01:01:20]
Right? It's two hours and change. But,
SPEAKER_0 [01:01:23]
you know, all in all, I was I was really happy. Much happier than I expected
SPEAKER_0 [01:01:29]
to be. I think in part
SPEAKER_0 [01:01:31]
and maybe this is my problem. Falcon and the Winter Soldier was a real low point. I thought that WandaVision ended high, but not like overly fantastic.
SPEAKER_0 [01:01:40]
And after episodes three of Loki,
SPEAKER_0 [01:01:42]
I I mean like, I don't know what to do there.
SPEAKER_0 [01:01:45]
It was just nice to have a good Marvel movie again.
SPEAKER_0 [01:01:50]
And John, you made the comment. I think we said on the last episode, which was released today, Patty hasn't heard it. But
SPEAKER_0 [01:01:56]
do you remember your your comment about
SPEAKER_0 [01:01:58]
after
SPEAKER_2 [01:01:59]
like
SPEAKER_2 [01:02:00]
Marvel is
SPEAKER_2 [01:02:02]
much better at movies than at TV shows, and I would have loved to seen, like, Loki
SPEAKER_2 [01:02:08]
as
SPEAKER_2 [01:02:09]
a feature film
SPEAKER_2 [01:02:11]
Yep. Or extended film or anything like that.
SPEAKER_0 [01:02:14]
Yeah. There's a co there's a cohesiveness to the story on this one that I think is solid. I guess it will be over by the time of Sayers. It will be. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We haven't seen the last episode yet. The
SPEAKER_0 [01:02:25]
thing that bothers me
SPEAKER_0 [01:02:27]
is is largely its position in the timeline,
SPEAKER_0 [01:02:31]
and the fact that I know that this character is
SPEAKER_1 [01:02:34]
not gonna make it, you know? But Yeah. The movie itself feels inconsequential.
SPEAKER_0 [01:02:38]
Right. Right. It's like, what does this do to phase four? Yeah. You know? Post credit scene does something to phase four, but the movie in and of itself, I don't think does. I don't think it contributes
SPEAKER_0 [01:02:48]
to
SPEAKER_0 [01:02:49]
to the fate. Who knows? I could be totally wrong. Right? I could be totally wrong, and we could all be surprised,
SPEAKER_0 [01:02:55]
but
SPEAKER_2 [01:02:57]
No. This was like, if you're gonna go watch chronologically,
SPEAKER_2 [01:03:01]
like, you would definitely watch this after Civil War and before Infinity War. Yep. And I think Then you'd have to skip to the end credits scene. Hold on to that for a while.
SPEAKER_0 [01:03:10]
Yeah. Well, yeah. I mean, what does this do to the Marvel movie watching order? Right.
SPEAKER_1 [01:03:16]
So a few things. One,
SPEAKER_1 [01:03:19]
now that we've wrapped up the entire movie before we get to the post credit scene,
SPEAKER_1 [01:03:23]
did you notice the necklace that Natasha was wearing for the entire movie? I did not.
SPEAKER_1 [01:03:30]
She was wearing an arrow necklace the entire movie. Oh, no kidding.
SPEAKER_1 [01:03:35]
Yep. So that's that's a little a little Easter egg tear jerker.
SPEAKER_1 [01:03:41]
Forever thinking about her BFF who ultimately is going to
SPEAKER_0 [01:03:46]
push her off a cliff. Did he though? Come on. Drop her off of the cliff, you know. No. I don't think he But I mean, some people would like would like us to believe that it was all his fault. Right. Right. So are we are we gonna do this now? Are we gonna jump right into the do it. So postcard scene, we get a character that we saw
SPEAKER_0 [01:04:03]
in Falcon and the Winter Soldier who is
SPEAKER_1 [01:04:06]
Valentina. Valentina. At this point, when the movie was supposed to come out, you would have no idea who she was supposed this was added later though. This is added much later Yeah. To
SPEAKER_0 [01:04:16]
it. So which
SPEAKER_0 [01:04:18]
I it makes me wonder like if if they were
SPEAKER_0 [01:04:22]
if this was slated for a different
SPEAKER_0 [01:04:24]
post like a different movie post credit scene like because everything screwed Possibly.
SPEAKER_1 [01:04:29]
But Yeah. Mean, would be interested to see okay. So
SPEAKER_1 [01:04:32]
Yelena is visiting Natasha's grave.
SPEAKER_1 [01:04:36]
Post endgame,
SPEAKER_1 [01:04:38]
sister avenger blah blah blah blah on her tombstones putting her teddy bears right and organizing the flowers.
SPEAKER_1 [01:04:45]
Valentina walks up
SPEAKER_0 [01:04:48]
Do you hold on. Conversation.
SPEAKER_0 [01:04:49]
Do you know her full name?
SPEAKER_0 [01:04:53]
La Contessa Valentina Allegra de la Fontaine. Thank
SPEAKER_1 [01:04:57]
you.
SPEAKER_1 [01:04:58]
Thanks Wikipedia.
SPEAKER_1 [01:05:01]
Valentina walks up who we have seen at the end of or throughout,
SPEAKER_1 [01:05:06]
actually,
SPEAKER_1 [01:05:08]
Falcon and Winter Soldier
SPEAKER_1 [01:05:09]
talking to US agent
SPEAKER_1 [01:05:13]
about his plans after being dethroned as Captain America.
SPEAKER_1 [01:05:17]
It is obvious that Valentina and Yelena have a relationship already.
SPEAKER_1 [01:05:22]
They have already made contact.
SPEAKER_1 [01:05:25]
And then Valentina
SPEAKER_1 [01:05:26]
essentially puts out a hit on
SPEAKER_1 [01:05:29]
Clint Barton Hawkeye. Right.
SPEAKER_0 [01:05:31]
Let's let's rewind just a little bit. Valentina
SPEAKER_0 [01:05:36]
in in the comics, right, She she basically plays on all the teams.
SPEAKER_0 [01:05:40]
So she's Hydra, Shield, Leviathan, and Janus. I don't even know what Janus is. Do you know what Janus is?
SPEAKER_0 [01:05:47]
That's some niche comic I haven't read.
SPEAKER_0 [01:05:50]
She's her her alias is actually Madame Hydra.
SPEAKER_0 [01:05:53]
Right? Our only exposure thus far has been with The US agent
SPEAKER_0 [01:05:57]
from Falcon and the Winter Soldier. Maybe the only valuable contribution
SPEAKER_0 [01:06:01]
not that maybe the second most valuable contribution
SPEAKER_0 [01:06:04]
that that show brought to the MCU.
SPEAKER_0 [01:06:07]
But third third third most valuable contribution.
SPEAKER_0 [01:06:11]
I can number them.
SPEAKER_0 [01:06:13]
But
SPEAKER_0 [01:06:14]
it's I
SPEAKER_0 [01:06:16]
this seems to be a a villain that we're gonna have in phase four. Yeah?
SPEAKER_1 [01:06:22]
Yeah. I don't I think villain is probably a little strong at this Anti hero?
SPEAKER_1 [01:06:28]
I mean, if you look at it so far, she has a Captain America and so far far, she has a Black Widow. Widow. It's like it's going a little far since she's a Captain American.
SPEAKER_1 [01:06:37]
But she has a stand in. So if this is this is where this is why I've been talking about the entire time. This is where I'm going.
SPEAKER_1 [01:06:44]
So I think their plan,
SPEAKER_1 [01:06:47]
she has a Black Widow on her team.
SPEAKER_1 [01:06:50]
She has a Captain America on her team.
SPEAKER_1 [01:06:54]
Taskmaster
SPEAKER_1 [01:06:55]
could very well stand in as a Hawkeye. If
SPEAKER_1 [01:07:00]
Thunderbolt Ross
SPEAKER_1 [01:07:02]
takes that Hulk serum to heal his aging
SPEAKER_1 [01:07:06]
body,
SPEAKER_1 [01:07:07]
she might very well have a Hulk.
SPEAKER_1 [01:07:12]
And then she has an Ant Man because she has ghost.
SPEAKER_1 [01:07:15]
Oh, okay. Interesting. She has all of these people coming around and then she ultimately has the dark avengers.
SPEAKER_0 [01:07:23]
Okay.
SPEAKER_1 [01:07:25]
Quote me.
SPEAKER_0 [01:07:27]
How much credit In ten years we'll check back. How much credit did it take to come up with that?
SPEAKER_1 [01:07:32]
You know, a fair amount. Mean, it
SPEAKER_1 [01:07:35]
is not originally my idea. I won't take credit for it, but if you look at it, think that's
SPEAKER_1 [01:07:40]
they're setting up something larger. Yeah. This
SPEAKER_1 [01:07:44]
is this is a transitionary
SPEAKER_1 [01:07:46]
tale
SPEAKER_1 [01:07:46]
between Thanos and when they ultimately have to do
SPEAKER_1 [01:07:51]
Galactus.
SPEAKER_1 [01:07:52]
Yeah. Exactly. Okay. So they they need a one or two arc storyline
SPEAKER_1 [01:07:56]
to prepare for 2030 probably. Galactus
SPEAKER_0 [01:08:00]
is in the future for sure.
SPEAKER_0 [01:08:02]
Galactus and
SPEAKER_0 [01:08:04]
the Fantastic Four.
SPEAKER_0 [01:08:05]
Right? Like there's a whole story line there that's that's gonna be big. We we know that Fantastic Four's gonna be pulled in. That's the Thanos arc. If you recall the first three phases,
SPEAKER_0 [01:08:15]
right, HYDRA was a big part
SPEAKER_0 [01:08:17]
of the phases until it fell apart. So I think I think you're right in that. This is a
SPEAKER_0 [01:08:22]
a larger villain, a multi movie villain, clearly, like we're already this is the second appearance here.
SPEAKER_0 [01:08:29]
But not the primary focus of the next set of phases.
SPEAKER_0 [01:08:33]
Yeah. Interesting casting for Valentina.
SPEAKER_0 [01:08:37]
She she does it
SPEAKER_0 [01:08:39]
absurdly well. I mean, at least how I perceive Valentina to be. So
SPEAKER_1 [01:08:44]
Yeah. I I think she plays the the
SPEAKER_1 [01:08:47]
agent that just genuinely does not care about anyone
SPEAKER_1 [01:08:51]
other than her mission and is crazy sarcastic. I I yeah. No. She doesn't. Yeah. It's, it's Ellen
SPEAKER_0 [01:08:58]
from Seinfeld.
SPEAKER_0 [01:08:59]
Right? Mhmm. And I guess she was in
SPEAKER_0 [01:09:02]
in she's been in some other shows since then. Right?
SPEAKER_0 [01:09:05]
It shows how much I watch TV. Probably. I'm I'm sure she's been
SPEAKER_0 [01:09:09]
in other shows.
SPEAKER_0 [01:09:12]
Can you imagine Sanchez yelling at the TV right now or the radio? Sorry, Sanchez.
SPEAKER_0 [01:09:16]
Okay.
SPEAKER_0 [01:09:18]
We've gone through the movie.
SPEAKER_0 [01:09:20]
I think it sounds like low teens for Patty.
SPEAKER_0 [01:09:24]
Maybe I don't know where. Go. We'll just we'll just put you at eleven. Low.
SPEAKER_1 [01:09:29]
Low. She was the president slash vice president in V. Oh, that's right. Isn't that an HBO? That's what she's in. Yeah. Yeah. It's an HBO show. That's what it is. Okay. Alright. There you go. So before you move on completely in this post credit scene, we have
SPEAKER_2 [01:09:44]
essentially what amounts to the grieving and funeral process for Black Widow.
SPEAKER_2 [01:09:49]
Right. So we only We did not get in We only have Tony Stark in Endgame.
SPEAKER_0 [01:09:54]
Then we have a whole WandaVision series about Vision. No. Hold on. No. No. No. Yep. We don't it's not just Tony Stark in Endgame. Right? There is that conversation that happens between
SPEAKER_0 [01:10:03]
Banner
SPEAKER_0 [01:10:04]
and between
SPEAKER_0 [01:10:06]
Wanda,
SPEAKER_0 [01:10:07]
right, at the very end of the movie.
SPEAKER_0 [01:10:10]
Or not Banner. It's not Banner. I'm sorry. Hawkeye.
SPEAKER_0 [01:10:13]
Right? It's Wanda and Hawkeye.
SPEAKER_0 [01:10:15]
So there's a little bit, but I I agree with you. I think that the the thing that bugs me about this is the only reference to Hawkeye is the is the, like, death sentence. There's also no banner in this.
SPEAKER_0 [01:10:28]
Now we we know that banner is gone, right, like this Ragnarok.
SPEAKER_0 [01:10:31]
But I do feel like in the post credits scene, they could have somehow figured out a way to loop him in if he's gonna stay in the MCU.
SPEAKER_0 [01:10:38]
Well, mean, have She Hulk coming up and he'll he'll be in She Hulk. Yeah. But like we have this you have this undeveloped relationship between him and Natasha,
SPEAKER_1 [01:10:47]
you know I mean, really and truly they dropped it though. Like they dropped it after Ultron and then there's a nod to it in Endgame. Yeah. There there's a there's a nod. Hi Natasha. Yeah.
SPEAKER_1 [01:10:58]
That's
SPEAKER_0 [01:10:59]
pretty much it. There's some tension. So
SPEAKER_2 [01:11:02]
Yeah. There's The other thing with the vest
SPEAKER_2 [01:11:04]
is I read some fan theory here
SPEAKER_2 [01:11:07]
that
SPEAKER_2 [01:11:09]
Yelena
SPEAKER_2 [01:11:10]
got blipped
SPEAKER_2 [01:11:12]
and this is what
SPEAKER_2 [01:11:14]
pushes Black Widow
SPEAKER_2 [01:11:16]
over it because she's all like Hawkeye, you have a family and stuff like that.
SPEAKER_0 [01:11:20]
Oh, yeah. So Yeah. So you call it she has nobody. Right? Yeah. No. I think I think that's an interesting theory. I think definitely possible.
SPEAKER_0 [01:11:31]
Is the the hit on
SPEAKER_0 [01:11:35]
Hawkeye
SPEAKER_0 [01:11:36]
what the show will set up with?
SPEAKER_1 [01:11:41]
What do you the that Hawkeye
SPEAKER_0 [01:11:44]
we got the Hawkeye show coming up and we know that Yelena now has basically an order from
SPEAKER_0 [01:11:49]
Valentina to go and kill Hawkeye. Is that how the Hawkeye TV show is gonna open?
SPEAKER_1 [01:11:55]
Yeah. I I don't think it'll be the entire focal point of the show, but I think it'll be an a couple of episode arc.
SPEAKER_0 [01:12:01]
And so will Hawkeye redeem
SPEAKER_0 [01:12:03]
Yelena the same way that he did Natasha?
SPEAKER_0 [01:12:07]
I don't think she needs to be redeemed at this point. You don't think? Because she's got she's got the ledger too, doesn't she?
SPEAKER_1 [01:12:14]
I'm sure but at the same time, the world does not operate the same way that it did
SPEAKER_1 [01:12:21]
when
SPEAKER_1 [01:12:23]
I mean, Black Widow was
SPEAKER_1 [01:12:25]
defecting to The US.
SPEAKER_1 [01:12:28]
I it's yeah. I I don't know, man. I think I mean, it could work the same way, but I still I still think that she's going to she's gonna end up being in a Thunderbolts team or
SPEAKER_1 [01:12:38]
a Dark Avengers team, something adjacent for a little while before she gets a full redemption arc. I imagine it like the Punisher in Daredevil season two, how he pops up for a little bit and he's there and then he he fades out. So IMDb
SPEAKER_2 [01:12:52]
tells me
SPEAKER_2 [01:12:54]
that Yelena is in eight episodes of Hawkeye coming out Alright. 2021.
SPEAKER_0 [01:12:58]
There you go. Wow. That's
SPEAKER_0 [01:13:01]
Eight out of I imagine the same. Episodes. That's a miniseries. Yeah. So so this this is kinda where I was going with this. Right? Like, I I have this suspicion
SPEAKER_0 [01:13:10]
that this is all set up for that. I I it makes me wonder actually if we'll even see Yelena in MCU movies. I I hope we do, but, you know, there's a
SPEAKER_0 [01:13:20]
there's a lot of material to cover.
SPEAKER_1 [01:13:23]
No. I'm sure we'll see her in movies. I I think that's I I really do think that that's where the next Avengers
SPEAKER_1 [01:13:29]
team up movie or mini team up movie is gonna be a
SPEAKER_1 [01:13:33]
an Avengers versus Avengers movie.
SPEAKER_1 [01:13:36]
Like, we already know abomination's
SPEAKER_1 [01:13:37]
back from the Shang Chi trailer
SPEAKER_1 [01:13:40]
and
SPEAKER_2 [01:13:41]
I don't think we have an official release date for Hawkeye yet. Just 2021 is what is listed. So Yeah. I think it was, like, October, November was estimated.
SPEAKER_0 [01:13:51]
Because we'll have what if and then Give me a break. The what ifs have been coming out progressively. They're a total waste of time.
SPEAKER_0 [01:13:59]
That's just Disney trying to fill fill time, in my opinion. Yeah. 100. And
SPEAKER_0 [01:14:04]
people wanna see avenger zombies. Sure. Fine. Like why? Who cares? I'm sorry. I've I have not been interested by any what if episode I've watched thus far. So
SPEAKER_0 [01:14:15]
alright. Well,
SPEAKER_0 [01:14:17]
anything else to say about the movie, guys?
SPEAKER_0 [01:14:21]
It was good. I'm excited for Shang Chi. Yeah. I do. And Spider Man. Yeah. Oh, there's definitely there's definitely more good stuff to come. I I will say this. I think I spent $30 to watch it at home rather than go to the theater. It was $30 Yep. Well spent in my mind and not just because I have three kids.
SPEAKER_0 [01:14:40]
Oh, language
SPEAKER_0 [01:14:42]
in this one was was a little more than any other Marvel movie than I could recall.
SPEAKER_0 [01:14:48]
I noticed these things because I watched them with my kids and had to keep telling them, like, we do not talk like Yelena talks. Yeah.
SPEAKER_0 [01:14:57]
But
SPEAKER_0 [01:14:58]
a lot of it not necessary either. I maybe this is just the direction. I don't know. You know, it is what it is. I will say it is just really really stinking nice
SPEAKER_0 [01:15:07]
to have
SPEAKER_0 [01:15:09]
Marvel back, right, in in in the in the movie,
SPEAKER_0 [01:15:16]
whatever, medium.
SPEAKER_0 [01:15:17]
And I am really looking forward to what comes next. I think
SPEAKER_0 [01:15:23]
this movie might be better for me at least because it happened after such a long lull with COVID and all of that.
SPEAKER_2 [01:15:31]
But Yep. You know, I don't know. I just don't see this as high on the list for if I want to rewatch Marvel movie on some random Friday night.
SPEAKER_2 [01:15:40]
Like, I think that falls at least halfway down the list.
SPEAKER_0 [01:15:44]
That's
SPEAKER_1 [01:15:45]
fair. I mean, it's it's I don't know, man. Like I think that if there were more stakes to the movie,
SPEAKER_1 [01:15:52]
it would have it would bring it up higher. I don't think the move that's the fault of the movie just when it came out in the storyline. I think you automatically care about it a little less because you know That what happened. Villains aren't exactly the most well done villains and that's always the downfall of Marvel movies. Yeah. Yeah. Like, Dreykov was a great villain but unfortunately, Taskmaster who should be the show.
SPEAKER_2 [01:16:17]
And Dreykov like
SPEAKER_2 [01:16:19]
didn't get a lot of actual screen time either and like all of Dreykov's villainry
SPEAKER_2 [01:16:23]
happened
SPEAKER_2 [01:16:24]
in the past really.
SPEAKER_0 [01:16:26]
Or in the room with a dialogue between two people. John, what you like?
SPEAKER_0 [01:16:30]
You like that. Right? Sure. Yeah. No. I I mean, I I agree with you. I think, like, there's a lot more to Dreykov.
SPEAKER_0 [01:16:37]
But I in the grand scheme of things, right, like, I I don't know that Black Widow or Dreykov
SPEAKER_0 [01:16:42]
are
SPEAKER_0 [01:16:43]
actually a line characters, you know. They
SPEAKER_0 [01:16:46]
I think the MCU kinda bumped Black Widow up to that tier that
SPEAKER_0 [01:16:51]
Captain America and Iron Man and Thor were.
SPEAKER_0 [01:16:54]
And
SPEAKER_0 [01:16:55]
I I think we're better off for it, but, you know Do you think that Thor takes an ibuprofen after a fight?
SPEAKER_0 [01:17:03]
Oh, no. No.
SPEAKER_1 [01:17:05]
That was a great line. Right? If you think about it it was a great line. If you think about it, Iron Man wasn't a a list superhero before the movie. Okay. That's fair. That's fair. You know what I mean? So I I I can really respect them what they've done with Black Widow, what they've done about Hawkeye,
SPEAKER_1 [01:17:22]
care making us care about Doctor Strange Right. Care about superheroes
SPEAKER_1 [01:17:26]
who are not the Fantastic Four and the X Men Yep. Or Spider Man. Yeah.
SPEAKER_0 [01:17:31]
Well, that's I think that's been the, you know, the the blessing, if you will, of Marvel selling away the rights to their their most critical IP. Right? Like they took some of the the beeline IP, the the lesser characters and made them a line characters. I I think Yep. With with Black Widow when I said beeline, I guess what I was reflecting more on was the fact that she did not have her own movies
SPEAKER_0 [01:17:54]
until this moment. And honestly, like, the Hulk hasn't either because again, I don't I don't I don't the one with Edward Norton.
SPEAKER_0 [01:18:00]
But,
SPEAKER_0 [01:18:02]
you know, begin to so
SPEAKER_0 [01:18:05]
alright, fellas. I I don't have anything to say. I think if if you've made it as far and for whatever reason you're not even seeing the movie, you should go see it because it's totally worth it.
SPEAKER_0 [01:18:15]
Yeah. Alright? Rented on Disney plus so it'll be the last time you'll be able to do that with a Marvel movie. Don't say that. Gosh, I hope that's not true. I want this to be the future. This is the future that I want. Hey.
SPEAKER_2 [01:18:26]
On Monday It's all over after this year. Disney stock went up and all the movie theater stock went down so Hey. Alright. Look at look at John with his Robin Hood account.
SPEAKER_0 [01:18:36]
Alright. Patty, thank you so much for joining us. It is always a pleasure. We will get you on and talk about something other than Marvel. We just have to figure out what it is, you know, and we'll come We can tell Patrick what kind of smoker to buy. Oh, yeah. Patrick, have you bought a smoker?
SPEAKER_2 [01:18:51]
I have not. Which he buys in Texas though, so he might have to build his own.
SPEAKER_0 [01:18:55]
We are not the four figure smoker smoker territory. No. I'm not gonna buy the, the WiFi trigger like I think you did. I did. I definitely did. Yeah. I can tell. I'm I'm watching. Watching. My my meatloaf is almost done in case you've been following along this whole episode. So I'm gonna go take it off and and let it let it rest for a bit. But Patty, it's been a pleasure. Thank you for joining us. Anything you wanna say before you go? Thank you guys.
SPEAKER_1 [01:19:18]
Nope. Alright.
SPEAKER_1 [01:19:19]
The final episode of Loki and
SPEAKER_1 [01:19:22]
enjoy it because I know I won't. Alright. Because we're gonna get to see Kang the Conqueror. Oh.
SPEAKER_0 [01:19:27]
Bold prediction. Bold prediction right there. You really think Kang is gonna make an appearance?
SPEAKER_1 [01:19:32]
Yes. John, this is where you insert the the outro music. Alright.
SPEAKER_0 [01:19:36]
Boom. Mic drop. Until next time. This is Dan Lemon reminding you help control the spread of COVID nineteen and go get a vaccine.